Translation in french

Discussions of the development process of the game.
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Arkatoo
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Re: Translation in french

Post by Arkatoo » Tue Aug 23, 2016 7:05 am

Hi !

It's my first post on this forum.

I'd like to lend a hand in the french translation.

I have a few questions to the previous or current translators:

- Est-ce que vous utilisez "tu" ou "vous" quand un PNJ parle à votre personnage?

I think we should agree on using the same pattern each time (except in certain conditions. I.e. : the people of Crossglen, that know your character better should use the "tu".)

By the way, is there a specific place where the translators discuss with each others?

Tomcat
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Re: Translation in french

Post by Tomcat » Tue Aug 23, 2016 11:51 am

Just keep in mind that many people treat the hero as a child. If using tu would reinforce that, then go ahead. French class was a long time ago for me, and I don't recall whether addressing a child as tu is universal. For instance, that custom varies among Spanish speaking countries, where in some, adults always use tu with any children, even strangers, but in at least one, parents will call even their own small children usted.
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Nut
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Re: Translation in french

Post by Nut » Tue Aug 23, 2016 1:02 pm

in German translation "Du" is used always, not "Sie" or the old "Ihr", even when adressing important persons.

It was really nice doing some translations, although it was more complicate than I thought sometimes...
Best to do it not alone. One could do translation proposes, and the other looks over it to aprove or suggest other version. And vice versa.
Quality will be much better and it makes more fun.

We communicated directly, e.g. via mail, and then in German. It is better to discuss some nuance in native language
Nut
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Arkatoo
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Re: Translation in french

Post by Arkatoo » Tue Aug 23, 2016 1:54 pm

Tomcat wrote:Just keep in mind that many people treat the hero as a child. If using tu would reinforce that, then go ahead.
Yes, I do think we should use "tu" everytime someone talks to the hero.
My question concerned the other way : does the hero use the "tu" when adressing someone older that it doesn't know, like I saw in some translations?
It may be justified in some occasions so I'd like to discuss of it with the others french translators.
Nut wrote:Best to do it not alone. One could do translation proposes, and the other looks over it to aprove or suggest other version. And vice versa.
Quality will be much better and it makes more fun.
I agree ! I tried to do some translations this morning and I saw that some people were already proposing modifications.
Nut wrote:We communicated directly, e.g. via mail, and then in German. It is better to discuss some nuance in native language
I'd like to but I can't find who works actually on the translations :D I intend to do some translations these days so, please, french translators, don't hesitate to PM me so we can discuss ! :)

PomCompot
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Re: Translation in french

Post by PomCompot » Thu Aug 25, 2016 11:39 am

I'd like to help too. In fact, I'm currently trying to finish the game so that translating wouldn't be too frustrating by revealing some points I've not yet encountered.

About translations, I saw that Launchpad seems to be used. A translator talked about Weblet, but I don't know what it is. Should we make a PR on GitHub once done? How the review process is done?

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Zukero
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Re: Translation in french

Post by Zukero » Thu Aug 25, 2016 1:05 pm

Yup, launchpad is abandoned. Weblate is the place to go now.
There is no formal review process on the dev side. We simply can't for most languages and we have a lot on our hands already. We rely on trust and goodwill.
Weblate has github integration, so I can merge what I need, when I need. Translators only have to worry about translation.
You should subscribe to this thread: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4711
That's where I send notices that are of interest to translators.

Thanks for helping.
Lvl: 78, XP: 8622632, Gold: 271542, RoLS: 1, ElyR: -, RoL: -, ChaR: 1, GoLF: 1, ShaF: 1, SRoV: 1, VSH: 1, WMC: 1, GoW: 1
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PomCompot
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Re: Translation in french

Post by PomCompot » Thu Aug 25, 2016 1:39 pm

Ok, far more easy to find the right tool with the right syntax :-). The wiki is not up to date considering those changes for translation: it still mentions Launchpad as the tool to use.

I would also be great to be able to switch the game language from the settings menu: better to spot untranslated parts and to map some terms coined in the forums with those in the translated game. For instance, it takes me some time to get what was the Cleave skill in my french version of the game.

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Zukero
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Re: Translation in french

Post by Zukero » Thu Aug 25, 2016 2:54 pm

Yup. The wiki is outdated. We'll certainly solve this by either updating the wiki, or removing it (or parts of it) altogether.
The most up to date documentation is the contribution guide: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4560

I really recommend setting up ATCS to help get context about translations, but it will spoil parts of the game if you haven't played it fully yet.
Get it there: viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4806
Lvl: 78, XP: 8622632, Gold: 271542, RoLS: 1, ElyR: -, RoL: -, ChaR: 1, GoLF: 1, ShaF: 1, SRoV: 1, VSH: 1, WMC: 1, GoW: 1
HP: 71, AC: 301%, AD: 38-47, AP: 3, ECC: 50%, CM: 3.75, BC: 101%, DR: 2

PomCompot
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Re: Translation in french

Post by PomCompot » Sun Aug 28, 2016 8:02 pm

I started to work on the translation, dealing one string after the other. It's comparable to the long and painful search of the Rapier of Lifesteal that I am driving in the same time in the game: one Kazaul imp after the other ;-).

Some questions and remarks.

For the use of 'tu' or 'vous', there's already in the translated strings kind of a convention. It seems that our hero always use 'vous' when talking to an NPC, whereas NPCs use sometimes 'vous' mainly when their are ladies or respectful men, or 'tu' when their are some more rough characters or when they really consider the hero as a child. Moreover, I have encounters some discrepancies in the use of 'tu'/'vous' in some dialogs concerning the same character. I have tried to fix them when spotted. There is also a lot of mistakes when using 'tu' with the 's' at the end of the verb missing. Fixing them too. Finally, I don't know if we should take into account that it is a middle-age like epoch, with the language conventions of this period. It doesn't seem to be the case in the english version. The use of 'tu'/'vous' would be impacted if it should be the case.

Next, it would be nice to get some dedicated place on the forum to be able to discuss the translation for each language.

Then, when saving a translation, how is it pushed to the upstream repository, the one of Zukero? It seems instantly commited in the Weblate Git repository: git://git.weblate.org/andors-trail. I don't see notion of batch save, pull request, … How the process is done?

Last, a detail but… Marrowtaint is translated Marque-Cœur, itself translatable by Heart Marker or something like that. I don't know where it comes from. It's nice and pretty, but I'm not sure that it reflects the meaning hidden behing Marrowtaint, meaning that I don't understand very well myself. Can somebody explain it please?

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Zukero
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Re: Translation in french

Post by Zukero » Sun Aug 28, 2016 8:27 pm

Thanks for taking the time to do this.
As a french myself, I always felt quite bad regarding the french translation of AT, but decided a long time ago not to get involved, and not to favor french translation over any other.

This thread IS the dedicated place on the forum for the french translation. It would be possible to add some language-specific sections, but these would require dedicated moderators too, as we can't police all languages, and want to keep the forum a family-friendly place. You could agree on some external place to go, like a G+ or FB (bleh) group, a mailing-list, a separate forum... I'd like to keep it all here though.

I have no issues with the multiplication of threads each dedicated to a specific translation point. You can talk french here, as long as you also add the english translation. Boring, I know, but it's the best we could come up with to allow translators to exchange while keeping some control over what's said.

For the GIT stuff, I don't use pull-requests for weblate, I just fetch the weblate repo in a dedicated branch when I feel like it (testing to do, request from translators on the forums, preparing a release), check everything out (on the technical side at least), and merge to the master branch.
When the master is updated (new text to translate), weblate will take care of it by itself, so you don't have to worry about that either. When I push new changes of this kind, I'll also make a post in the "Notice to all translators" thread (http://andorstrail.com/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=4711) so you'll get notified if you subscribe to it.

Marque-Cœur is indeed an incorrect translation. I'd say a more literally accurate one could be Souille-Moëlle, but it doesn't sound as good. Marque-Coeur is actually a pretty fine name for it IMHO.
Lvl: 78, XP: 8622632, Gold: 271542, RoLS: 1, ElyR: -, RoL: -, ChaR: 1, GoLF: 1, ShaF: 1, SRoV: 1, VSH: 1, WMC: 1, GoW: 1
HP: 71, AC: 301%, AD: 38-47, AP: 3, ECC: 50%, CM: 3.75, BC: 101%, DR: 2

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