whispers at the corner table

A place to discuss anything not related to the game.
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fiernaq
Posts: 695
Joined: Fri Mar 16, 2012 3:49 pm
android_version: 2.3

Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by fiernaq » Tue Nov 26, 2013 6:19 pm

Hate to tell you this, Zukero, but MSE isn't that great anymore. In fact, I'd avoid it when possible at this point.

The three primary AV comparison sites are:
AV-Test: http://www.av-test.org/
AV-Comparatives: http://www.av-comparatives.org/
VB-100: https://www.virusbtn.com
Level: 58, HP: 102, AC: 295%, AD: 46-56, AP: 2/12, BC: 35%, DR: 4
Gold: 75235 | RoLS: 0 RoL: 0 SRoV: 0 VSH: 0
Skills: IF1, Ev1, Ev2, Ev3, CE1, CS1, CS2, Re1, WA1, HH1, Cl1, HH2, DaggerPro1, LightArmorPro1, ShieldPro1, WA2, Cl2
Equipment: Enhanced Combat Helmet, Serpent's Hauberk, Marrowtaint, Quickstrike Dagger, Remgard Shield, Villain's Ring, Villain's Ring, Leather Gloves Of Attack, Enhanced Combat Boots
Last Updated: 02-Dec-2013

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Zukero
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android_version: 7.1

Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by Zukero » Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:08 pm

Damn it ! Outdated and irrelevant advice. I'm sorry.
Too bad, it was the least inconvenient AV I've ever encountered.

Guess I'll have to find another one.
Lvl: 78, XP: 8622632, Gold: 271542, RoLS: 1, ElyR: -, RoL: -, ChaR: 1, GoLF: 1, ShaF: 1, SRoV: 1, VSH: 1, WMC: 1, GoW: 1
HP: 71, AC: 301%, AD: 38-47, AP: 3, ECC: 50%, CM: 3.75, BC: 101%, DR: 2

ctnbeh13
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Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by ctnbeh13 » Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:14 pm

A Word of CAUTION:

Please, for your own sake, DO NOT install more than one anti-virus product on your computer. Multiple products interfere with the proper operation of the individual software. The best example that I can offer is something we have all probably witnessed upon installing or uninstalling software, which is a message telling us to please restart your computer. Doing this either modifies, replaces, or deletes files that were previously in use, and are usually unavailable for alteration or deletion until a reboot cycle is performed. Having more than one anti-virus program installed on your computer creates the same situation. It's similar to you sharing the bathroom with someone when your both trying to get ready to go somewhere. Most household bathrooms only have a seating capacity of 1. ;)

If you are currently experiencing a suspicious problem on your PC, you may fall prey much more easily to many of the "free" and "online" offerings that are quite often the source of such issues. The best approach is to be proactive. Regardless of which of the top rated, reputable, tested and verified anti-virus products you might choose, they are free after rebate several times a year on some of the leading online stores. This also includes many of the popular, reliable, and highly effective offerings that specifically are made to scan for adware, malware, and spyware.

Given the nature of "evil code", if you feel like you may have some suspicious activity going on in the background, it's best not to prolong your use of that system, especially to surf the internet to "research" your issue. If you are already vulnerable, don't allow a data connection to exit between you and the author of whatever you might be infected with. Hopefully you have a friend, relative, friend of a friend, etc., to reach out to, or at least another device to do your research on and possibly download the necessary diagnostic software. The longer you run an infected system, the more likely it will be that the only solution is to reformat your drive(s) and reinstall everything from scratch.

This may seem all very basic to many of you, which is encouraging, but also the intent. There isn't just one simple approach to resolving a computer issue, other than only what the financially well to do often choose, which is to buy a new computer.

It would be good to consider using either a hardware or software firewall for the added benefit of system security. Most people that I encounter who are experiencing issues with their computer, usually have neither. One last parting comment; "System Restore" should always be a last resort option, in all situations.
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rijackson741
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Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by rijackson741 » Tue Nov 26, 2013 7:53 pm

fiernaq wrote:Search terms would include "online antivirus", "free anti-malware", "antivirus scanner", etc..
Sorry, but do not ever install such software found via a Google search or any other random method. Not ever. There is a lot of really nasty malware out there masquerading as antivirus or anti-malware software. The same goes for getting a web site to scan your PC. Just don't do it.

If you want to scan your computer get the free version of Malwarebytes. It's real, and reasonably good, and the people on the forums are very helpful. If in doubt about any anti-malware software (if you do not already know it's OK, you should doubt it) check at http://www.bleepingcomputer.com. The forums are reliable.
Level: 64, XP: 4734786, HP: 196, AC: 246%, AD: 49-59, AP: 3, ECC: 25%, CM: 3, BC: 127%, DR: 2
Gold: 232355 | RoLS: 1, RoL: 1, GoW: 1
HH: 1, CS: 2, IF: 4, Ev: 3, Re: 2, WP:DA: 1, WP:1S: 1, AP:L: 1, FS:DW: 2, S:DW: 1
SR

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fiernaq
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Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by fiernaq » Tue Nov 26, 2013 10:40 pm

I may have been a bit misleading. I posted the simplest version of my advice based on an invalid assumption that everyone else here was as knowledgeable about handling malware as I am. I definitely should have given more detailed advice or just not said anything at all. Ctnbeh13 and rijackson741 are both mostly correct and it's best to follow their advice unless you know what you're doing.

By the way, quick definition since I see it misused so often:
Malware is the most generic term you can use. Its definition is "Malicious Software" which includes everything from Viruses and Rootkits to Worms, Trojans, Adware, Spyware, and everything else. In other words, Anti-Malware refers to a product that is Anti-"at least one kind of malware". Anti-Virus is a kind of Anti-Malware. A product that is Anti-Virus, Anti-Rootkit, Anti-Worm, and Anti-Trojan is also Anti-Malware.

One other caveat - You only want to install one real time preventive Anti-Malware solution at a time except one of the small handful of Anti-Malware products that is designed to work alongside other Anti-Malware products. For example, Malwarebytes Anti-Malware is designed to be installed and run on the same computer that is currently running an Anti-Virus product like ESET Nod32 or Kaspersky. There are a few others that fall into this same category and there's actually at least one real time preventive Anti-Virus product that is designed to be run simultaneously with certain other ones. Again, these are the exceptions to the rule and unless you know what you're doing you're best off just running a single Anti-Malware product.

However, online scanners and manual scanning tools are different. They are designed to be used on a system that is already infected. They don't run in the background and you shouldn't just keep using your computer while they're running. You CAN and SHOULD install multiple ones of these on an infected computer. Run them one at a time (unless you know which ones can be run simultaneously) and run all of them until none of them returns a positive result (positive meaning it found something). These scan tools cannot be bought at a retail store. The majority of them are free tools provided by the same manufacturers that create the full featured real time preventive Anti-Malware products and the only way guaranteed way of finding them is by searching. A lot of those manufacturer websites will not provide direct links to those tools. Only people who know the URL can access the pages but since search bots scan page text, searching for it in Google will often turn up those direct links.

It's getting late today so maybe I'll post the list of software I use tomorrow. It's hard to keep track of and the list changes all the time. What's valid one day may not be valid the next. My usual steps when someone asks me to clean a malware infected PC are to pull the network and any non-essential cords from the PC (leave Power, Video, Keyboard, Mouse) and then begin my research on a non-infected PC to update my list of software. Once I have updated everything then I'll format a USB drive, throw a USB protection software on the drive and mark the drive as possibly infected, insert it into the infected PC, and begin running my suite of tools. The USB drive will not removed from the infected PC (except during reboots) until the PC is cleaned and the same anti-malware suite has been run on the USB drive. Places like Best Buy will tell you they can clean a virus off in a matter of hours but the problem with viruses is that once you have one, you probably have more. Most malware features backdoors which let other malware in and your anti-malware product may not detect the first one or the second or third... Some of those computer stores just run a single anti-virus product, let it clean your system, and then hand your PC back to you without considering the possibility that there may be other malware residing on your PC that their anti-malware software didn't detect. If in doubt, next time you get infected, try it. Clean your PC with you favorite anti-malware, then run one of the other popular scanning tools. I'll give you a 99% chance that the second tool will also find something that needs cleaning. My typical turn around time on a PC is two full days with some PCs taking less time and some taking much longer.

Btw, bleepingcomputer is an excellent site. I've used it for years and while they don't list detailed solutions for every single virus out there, they do have comprehensive guides for many of the more common ones and you'll quickly notice similarities between the guides which basically boil down to them scanning with multiple tools until all of them claim the computer is clean.




Sorry for the long-winded rant. I've been doing malware cleanup for a loooong time and I used to do yearly testing on many anti-malware products. Watching other people try to defend themselves against malware is like a doctor watching people trying to not get sick. There's just too much mis-information available on this subject.
Level: 58, HP: 102, AC: 295%, AD: 46-56, AP: 2/12, BC: 35%, DR: 4
Gold: 75235 | RoLS: 0 RoL: 0 SRoV: 0 VSH: 0
Skills: IF1, Ev1, Ev2, Ev3, CE1, CS1, CS2, Re1, WA1, HH1, Cl1, HH2, DaggerPro1, LightArmorPro1, ShieldPro1, WA2, Cl2
Equipment: Enhanced Combat Helmet, Serpent's Hauberk, Marrowtaint, Quickstrike Dagger, Remgard Shield, Villain's Ring, Villain's Ring, Leather Gloves Of Attack, Enhanced Combat Boots
Last Updated: 02-Dec-2013

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Pyrizzle
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Location: Fire Nation HQ

Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by Pyrizzle » Wed Nov 27, 2013 3:21 am

Excellent posts and advice guys!

Thanks for taking the time to share with everyone! Keeping your PC safe can be a full time job
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Player Name:Pyro
Lvl:24XP:244KAP:2/10HP:80AC: 189%AD:13-21CHS:-6CM: 0BC: 20%DR:2
IF:2Reg:2FSDW:1

May Elythara bless you and light your path!

---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

ctnbeh13
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Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by ctnbeh13 » Wed Nov 27, 2013 3:39 am

The "free after rebate" software that I referred to earlier is usually always listed on Dealnews. I've found it to be faster to find using their Android app than reviewing the emails from the computer and electronic sites that I usually buy from. Here is a link to the app on the Google Play Store:

https://play.google.com/store/apps/deta ... android.ui
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Sarumar
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Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by Sarumar » Tue Dec 10, 2013 8:54 pm

ctnbeh13 wrote:A Word of CAUTION:

Please, for your own sake, DO NOT install more than one anti-virus product on your computer. Multiple products interfere with the proper operation of the individual software. The best example that I can offer is something we have all probably witnessed upon installing or uninstalling software, which is a message telling us to please restart your computer. Doing this either modifies, replaces, or deletes files that were previously in use, and are usually unavailable for alteration or deletion until a reboot cycle is performed. Having more than one anti-virus program installed on your computer creates the same situation. It's similar to you sharing the bathroom with someone when your both trying to get ready to go somewhere. Most household bathrooms only have a seating capacity of 1. ;)

If you are currently experiencing a suspicious problem on your PC, you may fall prey much more easily to many of the "free" and "online" offerings that are quite often the source of such issues. The best approach is to be proactive. Regardless of which of the top rated, reputable, tested and verified anti-virus products you might choose, they are free after rebate several times a year on some of the leading online stores. This also includes many of the popular, reliable, and highly effective offerings that specifically are made to scan for adware, malware, and spyware.

Given the nature of "evil code", if you feel like you may have some suspicious activity going on in the background, it's best not to prolong your use of that system, especially to surf the internet to "research" your issue. If you are already vulnerable, don't allow a data connection to exit between you and the author of whatever you might be infected with. Hopefully you have a friend, relative, friend of a friend, etc., to reach out to, or at least another device to do your research on and possibly download the necessary diagnostic software. The longer you run an infected system, the more likely it will be that the only solution is to reformat your drive(s) and reinstall everything from scratch.

This may seem all very basic to many of you, which is encouraging, but also the intent. There isn't just one simple approach to resolving a computer issue, other than only what the financially well to do often choose, which is to buy a new computer.

It would be good to consider using either a hardware or software firewall for the added benefit of system security. Most people that I encounter who are experiencing issues with their computer, usually have neither. One last parting comment; "System Restore" should always be a last resort option, in all situations.
Once again i need to give +1 to you Ctnbeh13 ! Your post are gold! But at same time my head hurts (perhaps thanks for my limited skill of english) and I am forced to give you also -1..... Can you please express your thought more shortly please please ?




@Fiernaq
Please do not adopt this bad habit of this elder god of AT... please
Sarumar
..dansing left foot polka with Hirathil

Lvl 313|XP 559721474|Gold 7965188|AP 3/12|AC 516|AD 161-175|ECC 48|CM 6|BC 311|HP 591|DR 2|RoLS 3|RoL 2|ElyR 2|ChaR 45|GoLF 3|ShaF 9|SRoV 28|VSH 13|GoW 1|WMC 1

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Covenant
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Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by Covenant » Wed Dec 11, 2013 7:16 am

Short version: if your computer is misbehaving, disconnect it from the Web and hand it to a tech expert. They'll pull the HD and scan it from a secure system for you to clean any infections. And then smack your finger for not having up to date AV.
Covenant 4.0 | Level:223 | Dual Wield: 2 x Rapier of Lifesteal | Dark Protector | Serpent's Hauberk | Marrowtaint | 2 x Ring of Lesser Shadow | Troublemaker's Gloves | Enhanced Combat Boots

ctnbeh13
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Re: whispers at the corner table

Post by ctnbeh13 » Wed Dec 11, 2013 3:12 pm

Sarumar wrote:Once again i need to give +1 to you Ctnbeh13 ! Your post are gold! But at same time my head hurts (perhaps thanks for my limited skill of english) and I am forced to give you also -1..... Can you please express your thought more shortly please please ?
I wish to offer you my appreciation, and hopefully an acceptable explanation regarding my writing, as well as the customary length of each.

In part, what you have already addressed is true. Even for those whose native language isn't American English, I have come to realize that even among those who are extremely fluent in American English, my vocabulary and descriptive text often introduce words for which a similar word in another language either doesn't exist or convey the full or accurate meaning. That is my limitation with only being able to read and write American English.

As far as the length of my average posts, there are many reasons for that, which I will try not to cover them all. :)

Obviously I fall into a minority grouping of people who don't really care for the societal norm of brief, incomplete, and insincere communication by any means.

I enjoy playing a casual game of chess on occasion. I'm not a Grandmaster or even anything close. I do try to stem the tide of potential follow up posts that may request clarification or additional information.

I also try to encourage the free flow exchange of thoughts and ideas, while not doing so to encourage the brief statements that follow one another like a text messaging exchange. Too many times have I been notified by email that a new post was made under a topic that I'm subscribed to, every couple of minutes, only to find some form of empty exchange that would be more appropriate for Twitter.

The Fallhaven Tavern is a great section of the forum where people can freely discuss just about anything, as long as the Forum Rules are followed. However, and I must state, in my opinion, there are many examples even here, where the use of the forum's private messaging system should probably be taken advantage of.

I have some awareness of how I and/or my writing is perceived, both in the general sense, as well as to certain members of the forum community. It is in part due to this, as well as feedback such as you've provided, that my posts and presence on the forum are limited. ;)
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