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Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions not
Posted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 12:50 am
by Antison
Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions not stacking.
Now I would not call this a bug as much as I would call it a defect ( here is an explanation of the difference for those who don't know), but here is my complaint.
I have equipped, the Gleaming Claymore of Ruin (GCoR) and the Worn Plated Gloves (WPG), both of which cause the Dazed actor conditions, all be it at different percentage rates and round duration. The GCoR causing the condition at 30% for 3 rounds and the WPG causing it at 20% for 4 rounds. Yet I've never seen them stack and I believe that they should because they are 2 different items. We're not talking about 2 RoLS not stacking. Oskar explained why they don't years ago and I believe that his reasoning should not apply in the case of different items providing the same actor condition.
On a somewhat related note, why is it that the condition takes affect on hitting a target when it comes to the WPG as opposed to on a successful blocking of the source considering that the gloves main purpose is for defense?
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Edited the grammar.
Re: Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions
Posted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 1:47 am
by Oet
Antison wrote:Now I would not call this a bug as much as I would call it a defect ( here is an explanation of the difference for those who don't know), but here is my complaint.
I have equipped, the Gleaming Claymore of Ruin (GCoR) and the Worn Plated Gloves (WPG), both of which cause the Dazed actor conditions, all be it at different percentage rates and round duration. The GCoR causing the condition at 30% for 3 rounds and the WPG causing it at 20% for 4 rounds. Yet I've never seen them stack and I believe that they should because they are 2 different items. We're not talking about 2 RoLS not stacking. Oskar explained why they don't years ago and I believe that his reasoning should not apply in the case of different items providing the same actor condition.
On a somewhat related note, why is it the the condition takes affect on hitting a target when it comes to the WPG as opposed to on a successful blocking of the source considering that the gloves main purpose is for defense?
+1 agree on you on this one.
Re: Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions
Posted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 7:24 pm
by Duke
according to the actor conditions list, the same idea as the equipment list, Dazed is listed as non stackable, and I'm not sure if they should or not. My additional question is, what is the actual percentage chance you have to inflict said condition when using the two pieces of equipment you mentioned? One has a 30% chance and the other a 20%, so together what is it?
Re: Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions
Posted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 8:35 pm
by sorrow
Depends on your duel weilding sp. If u have it mastered it would 50%
Re: Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions
Posted: Sun Dec 29, 2013 11:02 pm
by Antison
sorrow wrote:Depends on your duel weilding sp. If u have it mastered it would 50%
This is NOT true. And I'm not duel wielding anything. My sword is two-handed. Please re-read my original post sorrow.
Duke,
You really can't think of them combined. They are separate items, so on each successful hit there is a 30% chance for one and a 20% chance for the other. Which is why I believe they SHOULD stack.
Re: Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions
Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 1:59 am
by Mayweed
I think the two chances are handled independently of each other one after the other.
If the first item inflicts the condition, the second item has no effect because the condition itself is not stackable.
If the first item does not inflict the condition, you have another chance from the second item.
If the condition would be stackable (as bleeding wounds), both items could inflict the condition,
one after the other.
It's the same as weak poison: Drink a vial of weak poison and fight poisonous frogs - you will not be poisoned by
them before the effect of the first is gone, although it comes from a different source (at least I think so - haven't
tried it out yet). Or think about Blackwater misery: It does not stack, even if you wear all of those items.
Re: Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions
Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 11:30 am
by Zukero
I think Mayweed is correct IIRC the code.
I'll try to check this out later when I'll have access to my pc.
Re: Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions
Posted: Mon Dec 30, 2013 11:29 pm
by Mayweed
No, at one point at least I have been wrong:
If a non-stackable condition is active, it does not prevent a second instance of that condition -
it seems, that, if the second instance has a higher level, it replaces the old one (but not adds to it).
I checked that with weak poison and charwood sap (10% chance of WP 4x (10 Rnd)).
Drank a weak poison => 1xWP (10 Rnd).
Drank several charwood saps (until one hit me) => 4xWP (10 Rnd)
So I think:
Item 1 (30%) inflicts condition with 3 rounds & item 2 (20%) inflicts same condition with 4 rounds => 4-rounds-condition replaces 3-rounds-one.
Item 1 (20%) inflicts condition with 4 rounds & item 2 (30%) inflicts same condition with 3 rounds => 4-rounds-condition remains active.
More complicated it would be, if one instance of the codition has a higher multiplier, but a shorter duration than the other one.
Perhaps then the total effect is calculated.
Re: Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions
Posted: Tue Dec 31, 2013 12:05 pm
by Antison
I'm not seeing what Mayweed is describing happening when it comes to my scenario.
Re: Multiple equipped items providing same actor conditions
Posted: Sun Jan 05, 2014 12:14 am
by rijackson741
Duke wrote:My additional question is, what is the actual percentage chance you have to inflict said condition when using the two pieces of equipment you mentioned? One has a 30% chance and the other a 20%, so together what is it?
The probability that only piece 1 inflicts the condition is 0.3*(1-0.2)=0.24 (because if the probability of something happening is 0.2, the probability of it not happening is 1-0.2=0.8)
The probability that only piece 2 inflicts the condition is 0.2*(1-0.3)=0.14
The probability that both pieces inflict the condition is 0.2*0.3=0.06
So the probability that at least one inflicts the condition is 0.24+0.14+0.06=0.44 (i.e. 44%).
Mayweed wrote:So I think:
Item 1 (30%) inflicts condition with 3 rounds & item 2 (20%) inflicts same condition with 4 rounds => 4-rounds-condition replaces 3-rounds-one.
Item 1 (20%) inflicts condition with 4 rounds & item 2 (30%) inflicts same condition with 3 rounds => 4-rounds-condition remains active.
That sounds logical.
Mayweed wrote:More complicated it would be, if one instance of the codition has a higher multiplier, but a shorter duration than the other one.
Perhaps then the total effect is calculated.
I would expect that you get the higher multiplier to start, and it then drops to the lower multiplier for the remainder of the longer duration (so for example, if you had 5x for 3 rounds and 2x for 5 rounds, for the first 3 rounds it would be 5x, then for the remaining 2 rounds it would be 2x). I have no idea if that's how it actually works though.