REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

A place for general discussion about the content and gameplay of Andor's Trail.

Do you want to REMOVE Increased health +5 HP?

Yes
2
10%
No
18
90%
 
Total votes: 20

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Osho
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REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by Osho »

Increase health by +5 HP is among the options you get to choose each time you level up.

The question is it worth to even include this option when a large section of the players don't even spend their precious experience points on it?

Increased fortitude is a clear and a better alternative already exists in the game.

So, should this option be removed from the list of options that come up during the level up screen?

If yes, then what would you suggest as a replacement for it?

I would recommend an option related to;
1. Critical hits (incl. multiplier) Ex: +2 CS, +0.5 Multiplier
OR
2. Choosing 1 Actor Condition from the list available as a natural ability to inflict on hitting the monsters. This decision cannot be changed! No multiple conditions allowed.

For ex: Stunned condition +1% chance.

To those who have been triggered by overpowering concerns, please understand it's not necessary to offer 1% each level. It can be easily made available on the basis of 2, or 3, levels each time. So kindly calm down!

Please share your views.
eor
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Re: REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by eor »

I'm not a big fan of taking away game choices. I don't think +5 HP is as unpopular as you assume, (I use it until I am comfy w/my HP, then pick BC option, or whichever..)

That being said, I am fine with additional options @ level up.
Embrace the Shadowbunnies :shock:
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Osho
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Re: REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by Osho »

It's not the case of taking away the option, but removing it!

Because there's already a much more effective alternative available, which adds points to your health each time you level up. The multiplier effect every skill gives you more HP than a +5HP does. No reason to keep an inferior option. Better to replace it with something different, which adds to the replayability.

No player even bothers to mention the number of times they levelled up Increase Health under their signature. You will find the mention of AC, BC, etc.

What does that mean?

Players simply don't find it useful. So why not replace it?
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Nut
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Re: REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by Nut »

Yes, you are totally right that increase fortitude is too strong in comparison. It is too strong, because it is uncapped.
IF is the first skill for probably most player, and that's a hint that it is simply overpowered.
We already are in discussion how to fence it a bit, so that e.g. the +5 at level up gets more interesting again.
Nut
_____
Conina *, Lara: Lvl 44, Anwyn: Lvl 52, Nut: Lvl 61
eor
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Re: REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by eor »

some players don't find it useful..

That does not mean that the option should cease to exist..even if better options exist.

I'm betting there are some monks & permadeath players out there who agree ;)

Again, I like the idea of additional options @ level up 8-)

Re; IF skill, my 1st character used up 4 skill points in IF, but I don't recall ever using it again, I got bored w/it.. I wouldn't cap it tho.
One of my favorite things about AT is that there are infinite ways to approach your build and play the game. :D
Embrace the Shadowbunnies :shock:
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Osho
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Re: REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by Osho »

Nut wrote: Sat Nov 07, 2020 7:18 am IF is the first skill for probably most player, and that's a hint that it is simply overpowered.
Not really. It only hints at starting the process of getting health points on levelling up soon. Otherwise, the health points remains as is.

Also, I disagree that IF is overpowered in its current form. How exactly? It only adds +1 HP each level, which is less than +5 HP per level!

The multiplier effect takes another skill point and several levels of experience points.

IF would have been overpowered if there were no pre-conditions attached to it.

Tweaking IF would be a wrong idea IMO. Just to force players to use the other option it seems. Mist players would still not prefer it over IF. So it's not going to serve any purpose.

Better to remove it. And, replace it with something new.
sdevaney
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Re: REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by sdevaney »

I don't see a need to remove one option just to add some other options. If there's a compelling gameplay reason to add more stat options then that's really all the idea should need. Removing a level up option just because it is seen as 'not as useful' is a no from me but I'm certainly open to adding other options.

We are working on creating a game where we want the player to experiment with different builds and we've created stats, skills, and an equipment system that revolves around that core concept.

Our character customizations around stats, skills, and equipment revolves entirely around what possibilities a player could put into their character in terms of those stats, skills, and items available to them. This was a driving factor in going with the "distribute your own stats" system. We use it to create as many options as possible for builds that we may have never even thought of creating. Then we want to make sure that there are skills and equipment available to making those builds viable. All while trying to maintain some kind of balance between these options.
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Osho
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Re: REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by Osho »

sdevaney wrote: Sat Nov 07, 2020 2:44 pm We are working on creating a game where we want the player to experiment with different builds and we've created stats, skills, and an equipment system that revolves around that core concept.
That's the reason why I wanted to replace it with something that brings more replayability and useful options to experiment.

I don't use the HP option during levelling up, at all. Don't understand why it's included either. IF is perfect!

In fact, I don't get the logic behind including the same choice in separate options - AC (Weapons accuracy), BC (Dodge), Increase health (IF).

Skills should reflect the choices that the leveling up won't! If the experience points during leveling up are purely meant for building a character in different ways, then the skills should be focusing on different set of abilities, like inflicting conditions, and a set of both defensive and offensive abilities, rather than just adding to the same AC, BC in +12, +9 format.

How is +12, +9 different from +5, +3 each level?
CKork
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Re: REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by CKork »

Fine as is.

Also, +5 hp on lvl up can be very, VERY powerful in the beginnng, if you play PD.

Osho: Taking away choise just because you (personally you) don't like it is not a good thing.
Why don't we just remove all options and skills and have 1 predetermined path, layed out by you?

Sorry, if this sounds harsh. But variety is good, wether the option itself is feasable (in your opinion) or not.
Put yourself in other people's shoes...
Andor's "Vanilla" Bro
:ElyR x1:RolS x2:RoflS x1:RoL x2:HoF x1:ChaR x2:GoLF x1:ShaF x2:SRoV x1:VSH x3:WMC x1:GoW x2:BD x1:HS x2:
LVL 35 (+24 dmg, 2x IF, next to no quests & unique bosses, xp saved 2get2 lvl 80 straight)
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Osho
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Re: REMOVE : Increase health by +5 HP

Post by Osho »

CKork wrote: Sun Nov 08, 2020 9:00 am Taking away choise just because you (personally you) don't like it is not a good thing.
Why don't we just remove all options and skills and have 1 predetermined path, layed out by you?
Asking for the removal isn't wrong as long as there's a strong reason to make a case. If its so useful then why don't many openly talk about its usefulness? But, I agree, there's no harm in keeping the option of +5 HP either.
If I can enjoy truly useful choices with new additions over and above the existing ones then its absolutely great!
Given the limited community support, I didn't realise earlier that this could be possible at the moment.
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