Crafting / Combining Items

[nether]

Crafting would be a nice addition to the game and it would eliminate a lot of requests for certain types of items. In my mind its just a matter of how to properly fit it into the game. Theres a lot of things you have to look at...

I don't think it would completely stop the creation of weapons/armor either. There is still more weapons/armor with certain stats/types I would like to see, and even then I don't see why you would make it so you could have 1 item do all the work for you. Unless your speaking of crafting an item where you start at little to no stats on it then work your way up.

Either way, I think its all about implementation.

[Taledus]

Unless your speaking of crafting an item where you start at little to no stats on it then work your way up.

Somewhat... The base items would have a defined set of attributes. Weapons - how much they add to the base attack, AP, etc. Armor - block %, etc. From there, additional attributes would stack on those items, like Freeze, Shock, Burn, Stun depending on what the upgraded item was crafted with (Freeze chance = 25%). These attributes could be worked in to the current game just like Block Chance percentage is, but would only increase with the use of these items.

Specifics on modifications to the base attributes would be way to detailed discussing right now as the list could be quite extensive. However, the amount of gold paid + NPC specialist's skill level would add or decrease the bonuses to stuff like block percentage/ attack, etc. Eh, I guess my explanation is crude and complex.

If needed I will work up a good example list that details some of the specifics in comparison with the current system that is in place?

[Taledus]

Alright please bare with the rough examples here.

Base Materials | Quality:
Stone | Rough
Bone | Good
Iron | Fine
Copper | Superb
Steel | Masterwork
Mythril | ???

Rare Collectable Ingredients:
Ice Shards
Lava Shards
Lightning Shards

Item Attribute (% skills only available with weapon):
Ice Shards - Freeze
Lava Shards - Burn
Lightning Shards - Shock

1h Bladed Base Weapons | Base Item Cost:
Stone Dagger | 100gp
Stone Short Sword | 500gp
Stone Long Sword | 1500gp
Stone Bastard Sword | 2500gp

Now with the lists above:
Stone Short Sword + 300gp + 4 Ice Shards + lvl 2 Crafting Specialist = Rough Frost Shortsword +2 (provides 10% chance of freeze because it is stone)

The key here is there really isn't a set list of items that can be created. The quality of the item, as well as the % of ability for item, is defined by the base material it is made from. The quantity of the base materials, along with the skill level of the Crafting Specialist, define the change in damage, block chance, etc. The only real items that would need to be added to the game would be the base items, and the Rare Ingredients along with the attribute that they would add. Other attributes that could be added for weapons/armor: Stun, Fracture, Peirce, Cleave, Crush, Decay, Dodge, Parry...the list can be endless.

And this is just a small example for 1h Bladed Weapons...other base materials (gold, bronze, copper, silver) could be added for stuff like jewelry. This in no way affects items for quests, legendary or extraordinary items.

Does this example make a bit more sense?

[phydeaux]

I like the idea, plus, making the raw materials be won in battle rather than bought is a +
I was thinking sockets, excuse my WoW ref... be able to add bonuses to a weapon that way, better socket items have a much lower drop rate, destroy socketed gem to change to something else, etc.
I really need to teach myself java... Grrrr

[Taledus]

Well, base weapons could be bought, and raw materials could be dropped, or farmed through mining. I don't understand about the socket deal...I have never played WoW...

I haven't been playing for very long, but from what I understand people are finished with completed quests and have nothing else to do. This type of equipment modification could provide people additional stuff to do while waiting for future update, as the combinations would essentially unlimited for everything that can be created...not to mention the drop rate on some of the items would be extreemely rare to the point that it would make some upgrades very difficult to create.

[nether]

It's cool phydeaux, I mentioned sockets too in one of my other threads here

And sockets are easy. Think of it this way:

Item drops - stone sword (1). The 1 represents a socket a gem could go in. gem - (Blaze Essence - +4 to fire damage). You can then break the gem to get it out of your weapon for new enchantments after its been placed. Some weapons could even have, 1-2-3 sockets, progressively rarer of course.


There should be levels of crafting, a lot like how your mentioning with NPC's but first starting off with simple upgrades such as going to a blacksmith and refining your weapon for a chance of a few more points of damage such as the +1\+2\etc and then higher levels of crafting, such as npcs, and collecting raw materials to be used in the enhancement of a weapon (frost\etc), eventually getting more complex, with maybe altars\cauldrons\etc and harder quests to access these types of things. Despite that, NPC's will probably be the most important thing when it comes to crafting. Which gives me an idea...

What you can craft should be partly based on your decisions, like how your able to obtain different items by siding with different people; so if you worship the shadow, there could be the cult in nor city that will allow you further access into the recesses of their temple so that you may grow closer to the shadow and grow more powerful in that aspect??

But then again... there is always Kazaul and Elythara to worship as well

Same thing with possibly things such as the thieves' guild\feygard. They could provide different NPCs that would let you place different bonuses on your items.

It should also be done in stages... what I mean by this is that crafting a weapon should be separate from crafting a platebody\boots, or jewelery. That way everything cant be just done at one place and it gives you more things to unlock.

Having to create the blank weapon yourself would help IMO because once again, gold seems to be really easy to get in this game unless base weapons were very expensive\crafted items aren't very powerful. An important thing to keep in mind when suggesting stuff like this is that people grind a lot in this game. Some more than others. This game is pretty much set up for grinding. So you have to make things difficult to obtain It could start off as easy as a stone sword, then work its way up to harder to obtain materials. Depending on how tough you want to make crafting, you could begin with a progression like this:

Raw Materials\Ingredients\Components (combine to make) Forged\Assembled Materials (combine to make) Blank Item

The same progression can be used to finally apply the magical/natural effect of frost\shock\fire/etc/etc. Even forged\assembled materials could combined to make different ones in order to get your desired effect. Example here:

Stone (raw) + polished gem = (forged) sparkling rock + (insert forged material here) = Inferno Dust

Then, you can simply take all of your base materials and adjust their levels of potency, so like:

Minor - Lesser - Greater - Exceptional (Inferno Dust)

Of course all of this would have to be in categories... for example starting with the basic (anvil\npc) gives you the first and basic category, the +1\2\3\4 to weapon damage\attack chance\etc, possibly weak versions of the frost\fire\shock

Then you would move up to stronger versions of shock\fire\frost, no more damage\chance at this point. Adding bonuses to skills could be an idea, like a 10%\15% thing. Damage resistance is an idea. Protection on certain active conditions. These ones you might get from NPCs or something solely

Finally, there could be a third tier, where you get it from hard to find quest altars or something. This could give you new active conditions to choose from, plus it could also enhance your previous hard worked for enchantments. Of course like taledus said the possibilities are endless when you speak of simple things like new abilities and conditions.

Another thing to think about is how many of these crafted items will you be able to wear simultanously . Perhaps there should be some kind of active condition that only allows you to wear one or two. I only say this because I think dual wielding will be introduced? Perhaps.

Now not all crafting has to be in tiers. Some, can be simple, just like finding a magical item to place in your armor\gem for a ring to unlock its potential\something like that. What you get could even be random.

Now, my only qualms with this are three: Legendary\Extraordinary items, Enchanting your current equipment, and monsters.

If this is to happen, L\E's will need a new system so that they can also still have the edge they've always had in the game, in case crafting is easier than farming for one.

Second, will you still be\should you be able to enhance your old gear as well without having to craft new things?


Thirdly, if we give anything simple and new such as shock\fire\freeze to the player, monsters should definitely get some type of access to similar damage types\abilities.

[Taledus]

I should clarify a few small details.

The crude example that I gave was referring to different level Crafting Specialists...like and Sword Artificer in one town (level 1 crafter for 1h bladed weapons), or a Armor Mage (level 3 armor crafter) that is only able to get to after a certain quest has been accomplished or as a result of the choices of the player...exactly like you were talking about .

One thing I should point out is that a level 1 sword crafter can create the exact same items that a level 3 sword crafter can...it just takes 3 times the amount of rare ingredients, 3 times the amount of money, and the chance of a successful creation is 3 times weaker. Think of grinding for 2 days after some rare ingredients only for it to fail or not be a + 2 weapon, instead just a Rough Frost Shortsword...the ability of the specialist adds to how successful the attempt is and how powerful the item is.

The percentage of damage, like frost damage, is equal to the quality of the base items material: (Stone) Rough Frost Short Sword = 10% chance of frost damage, while (Copper) Superb Frost Short Sword = 40% chance of frost damage.

Base weapons though would be bought in different areas but freely obtainable as long as the player had the money...and considering that there would be a limited amount of base weapons they key would be in the upgrade...which requires finding the additional materials...which are rare to come across anyways.

Incentives to get players involved with crafting is requiring an NPC to be beaten in a quest, yet he can only be damaged with frost weapons.

Upgraded weapons cannot be upgraded again...so if I wanted to try to create something a bit better I would have to buy the base weapons as well as find all of the ingredients again.

Higher quality weapons, say for instance steel, could require a combination of several rare ingredients that are obtained from various regions of the game...similar to the socket idea you were referring to.

Prices of the weapons would auto-calculate as well for selling in the shops if the player no longer wants the item:
Rough Frost Shortsword +2 cost to make:
Stone Short Sword = 500g
x4 Ice Shards = 1000g/ea = 4000g (not sold in shops, they just have a price with them)
Donation to specialist = 300
=4800 - 30% merchant fee = 3360gp that item would sell in shop for.

There would be no list of how much the donation would be...as the more you donate the higher the chance you will receive a high end crafted item. Likewise I don't think the quantity of rare items should be defined...this should all be trial and error for the players. If nothing else, if this seems way to difficult to do, then just decrease the rarity of the drops to provide for more chances to create items. There should be a happy medium somewhere.

Aside from quest/legendary/extraordinary items this all is drastically different than the current method for creating items, implementing something like this isn't very difficult. The names I used in my example, Rough Frost Shortsword +2, would be done in such a way that it is easy on the programmer to implement as well.

I think with some more detailed discussion of the base items, rare ingredients, and skills to implement an idea like this could work very well for this game. Does anyone else have thoughts on implementing something like this?

[Taledus]

Oh, and the last part...not sure how angry people would be if they were unable to use their current bought stuff anymore. Something like this could just delete the items, or simply phase them out between updates. Maybe keep the current setup and allow people to sell what they have in order to bring in a new setup?

Something regarding this should be voted on...not to mention not many people have said wether this idea sounds like a good addition to the game or not. I'd also like to see what some of the others think, especially the dev's on this one

Edit to add: I think people should be able to equip however of the items they can have crafted...due to the rarity of the ingredient drops it would be a good balanced payoff for collecting the needed items.

[Piggy the Slayer]

It all sounds very Buldurs Gate to me. Crafting items was a brilliant part of that game. My feeling is lets wait and see what HEARTSTEEL brings to the game.

[Taledus]

It all sounds very Buldurs Gate to me. Crafting items was a brilliant part of that game. My feeling is lets wait and see what HEARTSTEEL brings to the game.

Crafting is crafting no matter which game it's in...it's all in how it works. Baldur's Gate had a preset number of items...I think what we are discussing here is quite a bit more intricate than that, where it not only adds a lot of uniqueness to the game by having essentially unlimited number of advancements for items, but can be tied in easily with quests in order to provide more depth and more things to do for the bored players. Plus this is not very difficult to incorporate into the game.