http://andorstrail.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=4096
http://andorstrail.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2379
These are a couple of old threads that discuss this issue and possible approaches to fixing it.
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Source code of the game - Contribution guide - ATCS Editor - Translate the game on Weblate - Example walkthrough - Andor's Trail Directory - Join the Discord
Get the game (v0.8.10) from Google, F-Droid, our server, or itch.io
Why the disparity?
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Re: Why the disparity?
Norbert
Lvl:52 XP:2597576 AP:12 HP:124 AC:282 AD:30-42 CHS:27 CM:2.0 ECC:18% BC:132 DR:2
Skills: CS:2 IF:2 Ev:3 Rg:1 DgPro:1 1HPro:2 LtAPro:2 FS-DW:2 Sp-DW:1
Equip: FP BSS JoF RoP PRoB SrpHbk GoLF EnhCH EnhCB
Other: DotSP VD GoW FB TG RoD+6 Oegyth:6
Lvl:52 XP:2597576 AP:12 HP:124 AC:282 AD:30-42 CHS:27 CM:2.0 ECC:18% BC:132 DR:2
Skills: CS:2 IF:2 Ev:3 Rg:1 DgPro:1 1HPro:2 LtAPro:2 FS-DW:2 Sp-DW:1
Equip: FP BSS JoF RoP PRoB SrpHbk GoLF EnhCH EnhCB
Other: DotSP VD GoW FB TG RoD+6 Oegyth:6
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Re: Why the disparity?
Tomcat wrote: In the meantime, more level ups on dam will make your game easier to play.
I know that the first 10 -15 levels are the easiest for grabbing, so I generally use those first 10('ish) to focus on damage.... and then as the levels become further and further apart, I start moving out towards AC / BC. At the moment, I am pushing level 32 and trying to grab as much blocking as I can so that I can survive against the spiders I know I'll have to face soon. Figure by the time I hit 40, I should be sufficiently stacked in AC / BC that I should survive a dual attack of spiders long enough to take them both down.
Alsa - Lvl:60, HP:174 AC:230%, AD:27-34 BC:174%, DR:4 BM used: 12 (Lodars)
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
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Re: Why the disparity?
Tomcat wrote:There is a thread from awhile back that discusses the current problem and some possible new approaches. Unfortunately, it was right before the game creator stepped away, and development slowed to a crawl. Find the thread, and see if you have ideas to add.Zukero wrote:We are well aware of this, and there are plans to overhaul the combat system and UI, just not in the short term. I target v0.8 for these. Who knows when in time that will be...
Tomcat, any chance you know where that thread might be? I'd love the chance to read through it. My time is limited, so searching for it ... not a chance this week. It would really help, thanks.
Alsa - Lvl:60, HP:174 AC:230%, AD:27-34 BC:174%, DR:4 BM used: 12 (Lodars)
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
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Re: Why the disparity?
Tomcat wrote:http://andorstrail.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=4096
http://andorstrail.com/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=2379
These are a couple of old threads that discuss this issue and possible approaches to fixing it.
Ummmm.... Tomcat --- Looks like you beat me to the punch. Please disregard my previous comment, and thanks greatly for this bit of look up, I honestly look forward to spending a little time (when able) reading through them.
Alsa - Lvl:60, HP:174 AC:230%, AD:27-34 BC:174%, DR:4 BM used: 12 (Lodars)
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
- Voom
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Re: Why the disparity?
The direction AT drives me is to Dagger of the Shadow Priests. Hits 4 times when AP is maxed and it gives an immense CC and 3.0 CM. Unfortunately, DotSP loses effectiveness atBethelAbba wrote:In the end, the limitation of action points simply will drive you in the same direction every time. That means you are essentially building the same thing every time you play, regardless of what you want your character to be. The illusion of choice that the Charwood quest presents you (Falothen and Fayvara's skill building) giving false hope to you that you can be whatever you want to be..... how sad.
If this is the given scenario,
Base AD 10, Equipment AD 10, Weapon AD 30, 2 attacks per round. Max damage per round is 100
Base AD 10, Equipment AD 10, Weapon AD 10, 4 attacks per round. Max damage per round is 120
then to have the weapon w/ high AD be balanced, you would have to increase its AD by 10 (to 40). Therefore, both weapons would offer a max damage per round at 120. But this is a simple fix. It is MUCH more difficult when you try to rank weapons by all their attributes, including AC, BC, CC, CM, AD, AP, and some other factors. That's why I used ATCS to find out how much in-game currency was placed on 1 of each attribute (cost of 1 min AD = x^1.23). The more the AD the weapon has, the exponentially more it is worth. It works this way with most attributes. DR is not exponential for example. I graph everything too. In this way you can theoretically rank every weapon and other piece of equipment in the game. AND, theoretically, you can discover equipment combo is worth the most. This complication is why we can't just balance the current equipment, but we have to replace the entire perception of equipment.
Voom
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Re: Why the disparity?
You know, I was thinking about this over the weekend, and there is a simple solution to all of this which actually would make weapons damage account for more than merely eye-candy.
Instead of giving you +1 to damage per level (as chosen) --- give 10% of base weapon damage increased per level (as chosen).
This means a dagger, at 1-4, after 10 of these picks, becomes 2-8.... but a massive great axe, at 6-13 now becomes 12-26. You still have the limitation of AP, but a dagger with 4 hits now does 32 max.... while that same great axe now does a potential of 52. After 20 of those picks, the dagger does 48 (max points in a 4 hit attack) while the great axe now does a MASSIVE 78 (max points in 2 attacks)
If you simply adjust the application of damage bonus to a percentage --- the whole game balances back out and people can actually build characters based on their desire (Paladin, Hulk, assassin, Rogue, or ranger) and the actual bonus that Falothen and Fayvara offer.... really are bonuses indeed.
Thoughts?
Instead of giving you +1 to damage per level (as chosen) --- give 10% of base weapon damage increased per level (as chosen).
This means a dagger, at 1-4, after 10 of these picks, becomes 2-8.... but a massive great axe, at 6-13 now becomes 12-26. You still have the limitation of AP, but a dagger with 4 hits now does 32 max.... while that same great axe now does a potential of 52. After 20 of those picks, the dagger does 48 (max points in a 4 hit attack) while the great axe now does a MASSIVE 78 (max points in 2 attacks)
If you simply adjust the application of damage bonus to a percentage --- the whole game balances back out and people can actually build characters based on their desire (Paladin, Hulk, assassin, Rogue, or ranger) and the actual bonus that Falothen and Fayvara offer.... really are bonuses indeed.
Thoughts?
Alsa - Lvl:60, HP:174 AC:230%, AD:27-34 BC:174%, DR:4 BM used: 12 (Lodars)
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
- Firefly84
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Re: Why the disparity?
You forgot that some weapons (daggers) don't have any base damage points and bare / monk build neither.
Your idea is good but then there has to be some adjusting to all weapons and bare/monk build.
Your idea is good but then there has to be some adjusting to all weapons and bare/monk build.
Firefly
Lvl: 114, PV: 497, FQ: 63
RoLS: 2, ElyR: 1, RoL: 2, HoF: 0, ChaR: 1, GoLF: 1, ShaF: 4, SRoV: 6, VSH: 3, WMC: 1, GoW: 1, BD: 1
DP: 0, X: 0, M: 1, BoGt: 1, SotA: 0, RofLS: 1
HP: 505, AC: 262, AD: 89-105, AP: 4 each, ECC: 12, CM: -, BC: 156, DR: 4
Lvl: 114, PV: 497, FQ: 63
RoLS: 2, ElyR: 1, RoL: 2, HoF: 0, ChaR: 1, GoLF: 1, ShaF: 4, SRoV: 6, VSH: 3, WMC: 1, GoW: 1, BD: 1
DP: 0, X: 0, M: 1, BoGt: 1, SotA: 0, RofLS: 1
HP: 505, AC: 262, AD: 89-105, AP: 4 each, ECC: 12, CM: -, BC: 156, DR: 4
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Re: Why the disparity?
The percentage increase idea is one of the good ones brought up before, yes. I'm pretty sure that the intent is still there to revamp the combat system someday, but adding content seems to be still the bigger priority.
And yes, any change in system will likely mean changing weapon stats etc across the board.
And yes, any change in system will likely mean changing weapon stats etc across the board.
Norbert
Lvl:52 XP:2597576 AP:12 HP:124 AC:282 AD:30-42 CHS:27 CM:2.0 ECC:18% BC:132 DR:2
Skills: CS:2 IF:2 Ev:3 Rg:1 DgPro:1 1HPro:2 LtAPro:2 FS-DW:2 Sp-DW:1
Equip: FP BSS JoF RoP PRoB SrpHbk GoLF EnhCH EnhCB
Other: DotSP VD GoW FB TG RoD+6 Oegyth:6
Lvl:52 XP:2597576 AP:12 HP:124 AC:282 AD:30-42 CHS:27 CM:2.0 ECC:18% BC:132 DR:2
Skills: CS:2 IF:2 Ev:3 Rg:1 DgPro:1 1HPro:2 LtAPro:2 FS-DW:2 Sp-DW:1
Equip: FP BSS JoF RoP PRoB SrpHbk GoLF EnhCH EnhCB
Other: DotSP VD GoW FB TG RoD+6 Oegyth:6
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- android_version: 6.0 - Marshmallow
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Re: Why the disparity?
Voom wrote:The direction AT drives me is to Dagger of the Shadow Priests. Hits 4 times when AP is maxed and it gives an immense CC and 3.0 CM. Unfortunately, DotSP loses effectiveness at.
Actually, that's not the only place where DotSP loses it's sting.
Alsa - Lvl:60, HP:174 AC:230%, AD:27-34 BC:174%, DR:4 BM used: 12 (Lodars)
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
Most Kills: Shdw Garg Mstr:3700(+3281 trnrs)
Gold:313,705 | HoF: 1 ChaR: 2
WA: 2, HH: 2, Clv: 2, IF: 3, Re: 3, MF: 2, DP: 2, LAP: 1, HAP: 1
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- Posts: 1353
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- android_version: 7.0
Re: Why the disparity?
Quick strike dagger is what I find to be the best backup to DotSP for crit immune areas. With Combat Speed 2, you get 6 swings instead of 4, which helps make up for the loss of crit damage. Or three swings and then step back, if you are underpowered.
Norbert
Lvl:52 XP:2597576 AP:12 HP:124 AC:282 AD:30-42 CHS:27 CM:2.0 ECC:18% BC:132 DR:2
Skills: CS:2 IF:2 Ev:3 Rg:1 DgPro:1 1HPro:2 LtAPro:2 FS-DW:2 Sp-DW:1
Equip: FP BSS JoF RoP PRoB SrpHbk GoLF EnhCH EnhCB
Other: DotSP VD GoW FB TG RoD+6 Oegyth:6
Lvl:52 XP:2597576 AP:12 HP:124 AC:282 AD:30-42 CHS:27 CM:2.0 ECC:18% BC:132 DR:2
Skills: CS:2 IF:2 Ev:3 Rg:1 DgPro:1 1HPro:2 LtAPro:2 FS-DW:2 Sp-DW:1
Equip: FP BSS JoF RoP PRoB SrpHbk GoLF EnhCH EnhCB
Other: DotSP VD GoW FB TG RoD+6 Oegyth:6