Page 1 of 2

Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 5:40 am
by NewAgeOfPower
Andor's Trail is by far the BEST free RPG for Android, but there are some flaws:

I) Forcing the player to spend endless minutes (or more) in transit:
-Many maps could be made smaller. But they have nooks and crannies and open spaces which contain absolutely nothing, yet force players to watch as his character drifts across the landscape, or worse, search endlessly in hopes of finding something.

-Lack of Town Portal or similar system. Hey, we can accept waking up after death in a bed, some form of Teleportation by beds wouldn't require a greater stretch of the imagination.

-Hordes of random enemies. While doing the Remgard area for the 3rd time (trying out all options) I spent more time drifting around and hacking up little doggies/wolves/foxes than anything else... they aren't even a threat. Once you've been back and forth over 6-7 times, you realize that there is no point in having 5 or 6 maps between her house and Remgard. 3 would have been plenty.
II) Developers seem to be incognizant of the 90/10 effect: 10% of the players post here... These aren't your normal players...
-Game seems to be more and more centered around extremely-high leveled players. What is 'balanced' vs an array of differing level 100 builds forces lower leveled players to build in a specific manner simply to deal with the enemy.

-When Critical Strike was nerfed the first time, it was noted by many players that there wasn't a Reset Skill Points or Respec option/button. Of course, the games' ultra-hardcore fanboys simply shouted "START NEW GAME!!111" louder.

-Combat is taking simply forever for non-level 100s. Not only are enemies getting incredibly fat, but also have very high Damage Resistances. The build which is in favor with our developers, and thus being buffed through the roof, high Block/Resist, is agonizingly slow at wiping these enemies out.

-Even a Critical build, now that Critical Strike has been dramatically weakened (lower chance and immune enemies) takes a very long time to kill these opponents (investment into Critical means lower base damage at standard levels).

-It is understood that Very High Level players like & deserve High Level challenges and Rewards. Why not have in the Supply Cave or other main quest line respawn some Uber bosses once that branch/section of main quest is done?
III) Necessity of Grinding, to the point of Unfun:
-The required level to be able to finish the game is steadily increasing. Even if one has a decent level character with god-tier gear, the skill required to finish the game seems to be increasing as well.

-Some grinding is necessary. This IS an RPG. The question is, where is the balance? When does the required level make the game unfun? When is it too little? What is the cutoff? Does a player have to have a level 40 character to beat the game? Level 60? Level 120?

-Remember, new players are joining all the time. I had one of my old friends who recently acquired an Android device play this game... he was immediately hooked. After a week of medium-intensity (1-2 hrs/day) play, he still wasn't able to finish the end quests. Of course, the bastard then proceeded to find 2 RoLS by his 358th rock... Again, players like him are the vast majority of your users. You're more likely to dishearten the average player when he realizes this game requires a commitment of more than 48 hours of play....
I'm about to collapse and go to bed now, I'll post more complaints later.

Re: Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 7:10 am
by nyktos
first off, this game is in development...
ok, that outta the way - lets do numbers!

1.)
the maps are empty... for now - who knows what will be there when you get the next update?
[example] Vacor's Hideout - popped up outta nowhere,
in a place that seemed like wasted maps between two major points...

2.)
- we are focused on new players, if you read some of my posts...
i keep starting over so i can "feel" what the new player does
[granted - knowing as much as i do, i can't really feel what they do, but i try!

- Criticals were WAY too strong, and now... they are still strong. Balance. (just wait & see)
and Oskar is trying to avoid resetting skill points because this is a game in the making,
and we all know this - why make him write extra code every time he changes something?
the next update is such a HUGE change that now - he IS considering giving Skill Points back.

- nope, i am extremely aggressive - with little or no defenses & cleared it all at level 38 casually.
the developers are actually thinking about the game when it's done...
in reality = i agree, we need to think about the noobs.

- you can get a critical hit almost every round by level 16, and every other round by level 8...
plus - the combat is being revamped BIG TIME. so keep your socks on, then we will knock em off!

- i really like this idea! (+1!!!) [hahaha - got you!] :D

3.)
keep in mind, this game is non-linear...
you can go where you want - some places are dangerous, others are not...
but - the whole idea is "balance" balance when the game is done, not now.
yes - we do want to introduce stuff for some higher levels...
but you can see that keeps getting pushed back.


this update, really... isn't that much more than what was already there.
if you could survive the iqhan cave from 6.10 - then Remgard should be within reach!

the last meeting we had actually contained some issues you brought up,
maybe we aren't as different as you think?

it just takes us longer to pump out updates than people who do this for a living.
we are just doing this at home, after work & between social events.

Andor's Trail is a big part of my life now,
and i want everyone to love it... (maybe as much as Oskar?)

so - keep voicing your thoughts!
and if you disagree with me on any of this, say more!
the players are the key!!!

thank you for taking the time to post this, really!
we need this input, and thrive on it.

it is really late, so i hope i didn't come off abrasive or arrogant.
just trying to get some thoughts out here, because i will be busy in the morning.

-MATTHEW-

Re: Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 7:23 am
by OMGitsMe
Well...

I do kinda agree with the first point, to an extent. There are a few terrible walks in the game, but you must take the good for the bad. The game is a journey, and thus, you should be made to *journey*. Remgard is for sure a terrible hike, but if the outcome of helping the city gets better with upcoming updates, it may just be worth the hike.

I don't agree with the second one very much at all. I feel the game is fairly well balanced. The point IS to be weak in the beginning, and become a warrior... I know that it is more hard for newer players since us older ones had those beefy rings of destruction and whatnot :D
But as for it just being for godly players... I dont think that the case. My character is one that suffered from the criticals getting rolled back, but to be honest, at lvl 30, I was still dealing 100 ever two or three hits, now I'm just DANGEROUS and not even close to level 100. It will be up to the new players to figure out a specific build (and stick to it to be successful.) There are MANY options, and some take forever to become truely effective (took me until lvl 30, when I finally had 12AP and dagger of shadow priest!) There are MANY resources at everyone's disposal (this forum) to figure out how to build, and to recieve advice! :D

Last, this games playability is determined by the user... No one is forced to do anything... It is the players CHOICE if they want to grind for those legendary items, or grind that EXP. to get the skill point they need for "cleave" or whatever. Really, this game is almost designed for any type of RPG/Adventure player.

I think the developement is going in a great direction, and its awesome that they have built such a great, active forum, that we can openly discuss these things. You can trust the developers will read up heavy on this topic! I think everyone should drop their "two cents" here!

Re: Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 7:40 am
by nyktos
OH MY GOD!

IT'S... YOU!!!

:lol:

[just a little comment, as i am running outta gas]

you know, i was asking for teleportation too...
and he said it was unrealistic.

so i tried to think up traveling systems, to make it more plausible.
like - a stable with horses...
you talk to the stable master & he can send you to any town you have visited.

(yeah, yeah... total EverQuest rip-off)

OMGitsMe wrote: I think the developement is going in a great direction, and its awesome that they have built such a great, active forum, that we can openly discuss these things. You can trust the developers will read up heavy on this topic! I think everyone should drop their "two cents" here!


+2 yes, it's a lot easier to get an idea about the players when they are all posted in one thread!

:D

Re: Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 7:55 am
by Xero
Personally, I play a build with no crit. My build focuses on multiple hits and consistent damage. I'm glad you are voicing your opinions. I feel like more people should be voicing theirs and the commentators should remain unbiased and think of the long term benefits of suggestions instead of how it may impact their character negatively. Then the game will progress for the benefit of all. so thank you for voicing your opinion and please continue doing so.
X

Re: Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 9:21 am
by DarkSavant13
I like your answers, Nyktos. Keeps me from A LOT of typing, and making this a book. :twisted:

@NewAgeOfPower
Some of us really want this game to succeed, and as Nyktos has said, want everyone to love it as much as we do. Because of this love of the game we sacrifice more than you think, but that sacrifice is worth it. ;)

For instance, every time there is a new version, and I'm talking about development versions not just versions you find on Google Play, I start a new hero. Why? Because someone needs to do it. So, it takes me longer to get to higher level places than others might because I go through all of those nooks and crannies you talk about with a fine tooth comb. Sure, it may not be as fun as just running through the game quickly, but it is rewarding for me in other ways because I'm helping to build something I believe in in my own small way.

Some of us also make things like quests, NPCs, items, maps, etc, all for free because we love the game and want to help Oskar make this the best game it can be.

When you talk about "devs", I'm sure you're used to talking about people that get paid for their work. There are no such people here. The devs here work for absolutely nothing except the satisfaction of working on a game they love. A game that is absolutely free, with no ads, and no profit whatsoever. Anyone can be a developer here, by suggestions, maps, quests, etc, even you. Because of your post you are helping develop the game, whether you realize it or not. The ones we call devs are the people that devote the most time working on the game, the ones that have meetings about things like your post. They deserve respect because they care more about what you have said more than any other devs making paid or ad games, for one.

Like Nyktos said, keep posting, for virtually any post you make can help the game develop and grow. ;) Welcome to the forums. :D

Re: Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:40 pm
by NewAgeOfPower
I don't believe I ever complained about long development times. At all.

Transit times; yes. A stable of horses would work too.

I wonder how you are built, please tell details...

A respec type system could be implemented just once, no?

I mean a system where you speak to a hypothetical trainer type npc, pay him a thousand or so, and reset skill points.

Re: Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 12:56 pm
by DarkSavant13
NewAgeOfPower wrote: I wonder how you are built, please tell details...
I am made of cheese. Mostly provalone and mozzarella, but with a little swiss here and there. :twisted:
A respec type system could be implemented just once, no?

I mean a system where you speak to a hypothetical trainer type npc, pay him a thousand or so, and reset skill points.
I've actually been wracking my brain over this... :P

The only way for there to be a respec, in my opinion, would be if you were knocked all the way back to level one,but keep your experience, and chose everything, level by level, until you reached your previous level.

It may be implemented, just once, even though Oskar has been against it, because of a large update. I wouldn't count on it being in the game permanently, though. ;)

Re: Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:34 pm
by Mino
I think a few of us have tried suggesting ways to get through some of the areas faster. I once suggested a "Sleepwalk potion" that would have you wake up in the last bed you slept in, without the XP loss of dying first (so its like you did the walk, but in your sleep so it seems immediate).

Re: Dislikes, Complaints, Poor Design Choices.

Posted: Tue Jun 26, 2012 4:48 pm
by DarkSavant13
Mino wrote:I think a few of us have tried suggesting ways to get through some of the areas faster. I once suggested a "Sleepwalk potion" that would have you wake up in the last bed you slept in, without the XP loss of dying first (so its like you did the walk, but in your sleep so it seems immediate).
Or ya wake up with a spider gnawing on your leg. :twisted: